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In this Discussion
- annismyrph July 2020
- DarkFrost July 2020
- OopsDotCom July 2020
- SandyCreekAcres July 2020
Who's Online (3)
- Cavalynn 2:01PM
- GoldenSpur 2:01PM
- Haystack 2:01PM
Trying to learn about White.
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Genetic Testing Results
Show all
Phenotype: White Spotted Liver Chestnut Pearl Splash
Pigment Modifiers
Black: e/e
Bay: a/t
Cream: Prl/Prl
Flaxen: -/f
Sooty: Sty/Sty
Pangare: p/p
Tiger Eye: -/TE2
Dense Pheomelanin: DP/DP
White Markings
Kit Genes: M/W3
Splash: SW1/-
Appaloosa Blanket Size: PATN1/PATN1
Kit Promoter: KP/KP2
Additional Info
White Factor: Medium
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I know you don't breed Olw to Olw and I believe Frame means Olw? How do these Kit Genes and Kit promoter fit in? Should I worry about these?
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Here's the table of all-white interactions including the Kit genes :)
https://www.huntandjump.com/faq.php#870
Olw is the old notion for frame, I believe it is just 'O' or - now.
Also, remember you are looking out for the highest risk white combination in any pairing, since they can only pass on one of their genes to the foal.Post edited by DarkFrost at 2020-07-30 04:27:23HJ1: 266615
Licenced for Watercolour, Chinchilla, Diamond Phantom Sparkle, Ice 2, NacreThanked by 1OopsDotCom -
In the example above, assuming you are avoiding medium and above risk. Due to the KitM you would not want to breed to a horse with W or W2, and because of the W3 you'd not breed to a horse who had W10, W3, W2 or W.HJ1: 266615
Licenced for Watercolour, Chinchilla, Diamond Phantom Sparkle, Ice 2, NacreThanked by 1OopsDotCom -
also try to not breed to an " excessive" white factor ; the more white a horse has the more likely for lethality
Thanked by 1OopsDotCom -
How do appaloosas get around that? I've frequently bred 2 Appys and never had one dead foal, and the Leopard appys have even more white. Can we breed the Leopard to another Leopard?
What does Kit mean, what does it do?
I went hunting on google trying to find a comprehensive list of the different white #'s along with a description of some sort. Never found it, but did read some really well written research that included discussion of whites, one mentioned there's a possibility of one more white, but I don't remember the reasons except something new had turned up in a horse. and he brought colours in cats into the discussion, I gathered some of the genetics were the same. I never would have guessed that. -
Appy isn't classed as a white gene. Only the Kit genes and the WF affect for death (I believe)Post edited by DarkFrost at 2020-07-30 06:17:34HJ1: 266615
Licenced for Watercolour, Chinchilla, Diamond Phantom Sparkle, Ice 2, NacreThanked by 1OopsDotCom -
it was probably White20 ; it is showing up in a lot of breeds now ( probably because the testing is getting more advanced with science
here is a decent article that might help you from UC Davis :
https://vgl.ucdavis.edu/test/dominant-white-horseThanked by 1OopsDotCom -
I'm not a genetics expert by any stretch of the imagination, so keep in mind that what follows is based on things I have picked up playing this game. Some of my ideas are most likely mistaken or poorly understood, so I hope that someone more knowledgeable will come along and correct me. (Ammit is pretty good about this. :) )
Kit is a very long gene that in horses plays an important function in pigmentation (putting color into the hair (and probably skin, but I'm not certain about that). It has a tendency to acquire breakages and more than 20 of them have been identified. Each break in the gene causes a different pattern of white markings. These range from the common roan and tobiano through the various mutations classed as "white spotting". If the two copies of the Kit gene are both broken badly enough, the foal dies in utero and is never born.
There are two genes MITF and PAX3 where breaks produce the white patterns known as Splash 1 and 3 (MITF) and Splash 2 (PAX3^C7OY). In the game, we also have Splash M, which is based on a gene that actually occurred in one stallion, but because it caused reduced sperm motility, he was gelded and so it is no longer found in real horses.
Appaloosa is, I think, a completely different complex of genes totally unrelated to either Kit or the various Splash mutations.
There are no lethal issues with Appaloosa. Kit mutations can be dangerous in some combinations and/or higher White Factor. Splash 1 and Splash M work in combination with any Splash mutation combination. Splash 2 and 3 are homozygous lethal and lethal together.
Frame is another separate gene that can be lethal if a foal gets 2 copies.Post edited by SandyCreekAcres at 2020-07-30 20:03:24Thanked by 1OopsDotCom -
=Gets out the notebook...=