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In this Discussion
- Ammit September 2020
- annismyrph September 2020
- HarmonyC September 2020
- HorseAngel September 2020
- Horseloverofsk April 2021
- Nightphoenix September 2020
- WhiteValley September 2020
- WitchwaterAcres September 2020
- Wolvevenfrost September 2020
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- annismyrph 12:30PM
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Frame in real life
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Several members of the community have expressed interest in learning about the real life version of frame, so I will be using this post to share what I have learned in my ongoing study of equine genetics.
What is frame?
Frame, or frame overo, is a type of pinto pattern. It appears to be found primarily in the American Paint Horse. It can, however, be found in other horse breeds including the American Quarter Horse, the Thoroughbred, the miniature horse, and several other breeds.
Why is frame dangerous?
Frame is dangerous because the gene is lethal in its homozygous form (when the foal gets one copy of the gene from each parent). When two frame carriers are bred together, there is a 25% chance that the foal will die soon after birth. And the foal WILL die. There is no treatment for this lethal gene combination.
What happens if a lethal foal is born?
When a homozygous frame foal is born, it is typically pure white. The foal may seem fine at first. It might stand up, nurse, and move around. But soon it becomes obvious that there is something seriously wrong. Within a few days, the foal is dead.
Why does the foal die?
I don’t know the technical terms for this, so this is my version.
When the two frame genes come together during conception, something goes very, very wrong.
Homozygous frame prevents the intestinal tract from forming correctly. The nerves don’t develop properly. This is why the foal can seem fine at first. It’s when it is time to eliminate that it becomes clear that there is a problem. Because the intestinal nerves don’t develop correctly, the lethal foal is unable to poop. This causes the foal to colic.
The foal usually dies within three days. This slow death is extremely painful, which is why most lethal white foals are euthanized soon after birth (before they start to really feel the pain).
Why do people take the risk of a lethal foal? Why don’t they just not breed two carriers together?
Unfortunately, it’s not that simple. Frame can hide. A horse carrying a copy of frame can be completely solid colored with absolutely no white except for a tiny part of the face. The only way to know for sure if a horse carries frame is through genetic testing.
Conclusion
While frame is definitely beautiful, it is also very dangerous. If a homozygous frame foal is born, the only thing that can be done to help the foal is to humanely euthanize it so it will not spend its few days in this world dying an agonizing death.Post edited by Nightphoenix at 2020-09-29 05:33:22I’m autistic and I struggle with any kind of communication, so I apologize in advance if I say anything rude or offensive because there’s a 99% chance that I have no clue I did it. I appreciate your patience with me! -
Wow, thank you so much for this information! That's so sad, but really interesting to know.Formerly OscarWildin
267111Thanked by 1Nightphoenix -
That is so so sad but very wonderful information and knowledge to know and remember!❤Thanked by 1Nightphoenix
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I knew it was something to do with the intestines but didn't know it was the nerves. Very interesting. Thank you.Thanked by 1Nightphoenix
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Thankyou ; informative and well written i Think i am going to bookmark this for Future newbies :) to help explain it
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Pigment is an important part of nerve development. It is the same reason splash can cause deafness. Nerves in the ear canal don't form. Remember missing pigment is a sign that something was incorrect during development.Need to contact me? Read this first.
I sometimes get busy and miss things. If your private message, question, etc. gets missed please ping me so I can follow up with you. I am also always happy to explain or clarify. (HAJ does not have a customer service email, please send me a forum message! )
she/her -
Also why few spot appaloosa horses can have moon blindness.I’m autistic and I struggle with any kind of communication, so I apologize in advance if I say anything rude or offensive because there’s a 99% chance that I have no clue I did it. I appreciate your patience with me!
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All hom appies are night blind. It is not nerves but calcium channel issues with appies but yup same principle!Need to contact me? Read this first.
I sometimes get busy and miss things. If your private message, question, etc. gets missed please ping me so I can follow up with you. I am also always happy to explain or clarify. (HAJ does not have a customer service email, please send me a forum message! )
she/her -
I knew it was all hom appies, but I was curious about the leopard gene in general because my barn has a Pony of the Americas with moon/night blindness, but he is solid chestnut...I’m autistic and I struggle with any kind of communication, so I apologize in advance if I say anything rude or offensive because there’s a 99% chance that I have no clue I did it. I appreciate your patience with me!
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Appaloosa causes night blindness. Equine recurrent uveitis or Moon blindness is a different condition. Appies seem prone to it but any horse can go moon blind as it is caused by an infection.Post edited by Ammit at 2020-09-29 09:31:21Need to contact me? Read this first.
I sometimes get busy and miss things. If your private message, question, etc. gets missed please ping me so I can follow up with you. I am also always happy to explain or clarify. (HAJ does not have a customer service email, please send me a forum message! )
she/her -
Wow, this is all great information! Appies are some of my favorite real life horses! But its really sad that most White genes can cause so many of these problems and really unfair that there so pretty too!Celestial Angels, The Balinor Breed! We Specialize In Riding Horses & Ponies!
HJ1 ID Number- 253402, Balinor Stables
She/her -
11507056
This mare is a great example for both in game and real life. She has no white markings, but she is heterozygous for frame. If she wasn’t from a herd helper and I hadn’t put her through genetic testing, I would never know that she has frame. I would only find out that she carries frame when she gives birth to a lethal white foal, and by then it is too late.
It works the same way for real life horses.I’m autistic and I struggle with any kind of communication, so I apologize in advance if I say anything rude or offensive because there’s a 99% chance that I have no clue I did it. I appreciate your patience with me! -
That's very interesting but sad too. Thanks for the info!! :) :)Breeding appaloosa's and roan's. Not licensed at all. Free player.Thanked by 1Nightphoenix