HGG Community Forums

@silverstar

Would you condider this stud as bootstrapped?


AVR Damirette Kaylar

I would add a 4th to Silverstar's list. Long-lined. Horses with generations too numerous to count. Even/uneven generations no longer matter. At this point, to get superior foals you're usually resorting to boosting.

Here is one of my long-lined stallions.

jm Marrazo Moonsword

I think people do have different definitions of the various terms here, along with having different preferences for what they do with their horses. So I could see how different players could call the same horse uneven vs. bootstrapped and I could also see some players not bothering to worry about it with higher generation horses while others would still label the horse as technically uneven.

I'd personally say that all bootstrapped horses are uneven bred, but not all uneven horses are necessarily bootstrapped.

So an uneven bred horse might have one ancestor who wasn't bred precisely to the same generation, but wouldn't necessarily be part of a bootstrapping program to rapidly jump up in paper/PT. That would more involve using a high-papered stallion with foundation mares and then breeding that same stallion to their superior fillies to get rapidly improving offspring. Those horses would be both uneven and bootstrapped.

I think that often if you're trying to breed "even generations", having a bootstrapped horse would be more disruptive, both for assessing quality going forward and for the visual appearance of the pedigree. Having a horse with a bit of uneven breeding would probably not be the end of the world unless you personally prefer to stick to a strict "only even" breeding rule.

I'd also agree with @Johara that at a certain point, it becomes really difficult to improve on breeding quality regardless (and also tricky to view the whole pedigree). I haven't bred that far myself, so I don't really know what the typical generation would be for that to occur (probably a bit faster if you start with red/B foundations or boosted blue/A foundations).

@Johara @CrowsnestRidge and @FlameKitten explained it well and I think they covered everything I meant with my first statement.

Everyone looks and views horse lines differently. Most people only really worry about two types of breeding bootstrapping and even breeding. In my experience the only reason you would need to know what category your horse fits into is if you are trying to sell babied, straws and eggs. If thats the case only the Even Generation breeders will care about generation. If they are as nit picky as I am then they will go through the horses pedigree themselves and make sure it fits what they want.

If you don’t want to organize your account like that then don’t. Do whatever makes you happy.

a superior stud being bred to an inferior mare.

This is the correct use of the term boostrap. It does not mean uneven breed. It means taking a stud like a star and using him to get show horses as fast as possible. Once you are breeding like to like even if the line WAS bootstrapped you are no longer bootstrapping.

Thanks Ammit, that that's what I understood the term to mean. Many people use bootstrap for any uneven/long lined horse, maybe it's because they use them for bootstrapping? Either way yes the term gets overused I think for any uneven bred horses

@foreshadow. How far back do you check for eveness? I find it harder (gives me a headache) after 8 generations

I ve traced them back to 21 generations lol just to see